Ideen / Vorschläge

[blotunga]

aber ich fände eine (meinetwegen niedrigere) Untergrenze für andere Minors auch sinnvoll.

Ich kann es nicht lassen noch einmal darauf zurückzukommen. Ich hatte schon wieder einen Minor mit einem 9,9 Milliarden System. Das ist natürlich nicht annähernd so schlimm, wie ein System mit 1,3 Milliarden. Aber ich finde das für ein Minorsystem einfach zu wenig.

Wenn der Minor keine Spezialschiffe hat, dan ist es möglich. Wenn wir aber die Minors noch stärker machen dann haben wieder Heyoun und Terraner einen vorteil mMn.

[blotunga]

I've thought about the manager info, and at first I've thought about placing a button next to free labor units, however the Rotharians have a graphic there . What I could do is to grey out all the worker allocations when the manager is active since they have no effect anyway.

[Pawleus]

I've thought about the manager info, and at first I've thought about placing a button next to free labor units, however the Rotharians have a graphic there . What I could do is to grey out all the worker allocations when the manager is active since they have no effect anyway.

I think it could be enough, although the additional ability to turn the manager off by eg. trying to change those grayed worker allocations would have been almost perfect

[blotunga]

I've thought about the manager info, and at first I've thought about placing a button next to free labor units, however the Rotharians have a graphic there . What I could do is to grey out all the worker allocations when the manager is active since they have no effect anyway.

I think it could be enough, although the additional ability to turn the manager off by eg. trying to change those grayed worker allocations would have been almost perfect

The problem is that I'd have to cram even more buttons on the screen... Even now they are too many for my taste on some.

[Pawleus]

No additional buttons are needed - if a player tries to change the grayed bar it should automatically turn the manager off

[blotunga]

No additional buttons are needed - if a player tries to change the grayed bar it should automatically turn the manager off

But then he still has to switch back to the manager screen to re-activate it. And it might be a bit counter-intuitive for the players. Also it can be triggered accidentally...

[Pawleus]

No additional buttons are needed - if a player tries to change the grayed bar it should automatically turn the manager off

But then he still has to switch back to the manager screen to re-activate it. And it might be a bit counter-intuitive for the players. Also it can be triggered accidentally...

That's why I said it's almost perfect

Edit: Actually, switching it on could be achieved by double-clicking the bars or by a long-click

[blotunga]

Btw. I forgot (I haven't played the game actually for some time now) that setting Industry to Fill All and turning on "Optimize Production" will do exactly what you want namely 1-turn building if possible...

[Pawleus]

Btw. I forgot (I haven't played the game actually for some time now) that setting Industry to Fill All and turning on "Optimize Production" will do exactly what you want namely 1-turn building if possible...

It will usually do it but with some exceptions, eg. when you have several bars set to fill all and sufficiently high-level science buildings it sometimes prefers them (or even food and even though they are not set to fill all) over industry and sets the industry to construct in less than 1 turn. It might actually even be more beneficial in this way, generally - this is why I suggested to add an additional option, not change the current behavior.

Edit: BTW, I have an idea how waypoints (those needed eg. to go through dangerous anomalies) should be arranged: a player could have an option to long-click on a sector (having a fleet selected, first, and without moving the pointer because moving it while long-clicking should move the map as it is now) - it would establish a waypoint and then he would normally click on a destination sector to set the whole route. Long-clicking the waypoint again (having the fleet selected) should cancel it (if a player changes his mind before ending his turn). What do you think?

[blotunga]

Btw. I forgot (I haven't played the game actually for some time now) that setting Industry to Fill All and turning on "Optimize Production" will do exactly what you want namely 1-turn building if possible...

It will usually do it but with some exceptions, eg. when you have several bars set to fill all and sufficiently high-level science buildings it sometimes prefers them (or even food) over industry and sets the industry to construct in less than 1 turn. It might actually even be more beneficial in this way, generally - this is why I suggested to add an additional option, not change the current behavior.

I think the current functionality is ok, you can leave industry on Fill ALL and without Optimize Industry. It still won't fill up more than needed.

Edit: BTW, I have an idea how waypoints (those needed eg. to go through dangerous anomalies) should be arranged: a player could have an option to long-click on a sector (having a fleet selected, first, and without moving the pointer - moving it while long-clicking should move the map as it is now) - it would establish a waypoint and then he would normally click on a destination sector to set the whole route. Long-clicking the waypoint again (having the fleet selected) should cancel it (if a player changes his mind before ending his turn). What do you think?

Long pressing on android is for tooltips, so can't do. Besides the current path calculations would have to be rewritten if we'd support waypoints. And it rarely goes around an anomaly if it doesn't hast to, and those anomalies usually destroy your ships.

[Pawleus]

I think the current functionality is ok, you can leave industry on Fill ALL and without Optimize Industry. It still won't fill up more than needed.

It doesn't work as well as you say - look in the save I provided at the system named Sterope: there is a Titanium Mine in the queue and whether you Optimize Industry or not it still is a 2-turn construction despite being perfectly capable of building it in 1 turn with the manager off (it needs only 2 more units in the industry having already 9 in the science). The more I see it the more I am inclined to classify it as a bug in the manager.

Long pressing on android is for tooltips, so can't do. Besides the current path calculations would have to be rewritten if we'd support waypoints. And it rarely goes around an anomaly if it doesn't hast to, and those anomalies usually destroy your ships.

Really? But you already have a long-click for the cancellation of scrapping buildings... If it's too much work or it's an intended feature then it's fair enough - I don't consider it being essential. However, there are many anomalies that are only slightly harmful (eg. those with experience lost) and even for those much more dangerous I would sometimes prefer to risk a small fleet as to have a larger chance of winning a large battle. The more competitive the game is the more inclined I would be to take such risks so it's especially important for multiplayer - it's not a gamechanger, though, so no pressure.

What I consider essential for the game is this second kind of waypoints I mentioned (ships moving automatically in space after their construction to a chosen waypoint: sector or fleet) - have you thought about it? It saves so much time for players that it's a necessary feature and I am very disappointed seeing any 4X game without it.

Edit: Hm, I've just realized that perhaps there is an easy way: no waypoints of the first kind, but there could be an option among Immediate Orders: Disregard Anomalies - a ship (a fleet) with this order would move as if there are no anomalies (taking damage if necessary). What do you say? Has it already been coded to take damage (or other harmful effects) on the fly? Or perhaps it's the reason why we can't fly through dangerous anomalies? IIRC, it wasn't coded in BotF.

[blotunga]

It doesn't work as well as you say - look in the save I provided at the system named Sterope: there is a Titanium Mine in the queue and whether you Optimize Industry or not it still is a 2-turn construction despite being perfectly capable of building it in 1 turn with the manager off (it needs only 2 more units in the industry having already 9 in the science). The more I see it the more I am inclined to classify it as a bug in the manager.

You're right. I will have to look into it sometime.

Really? But you already have a long-click for the cancellation of scrapping buildings... If it's too much work or it's an intended feature then it's fair enough - I don't consider it being essential. However, there are many anomalies that are only slightly harmful (eg. those with experience lost) and even for those much more dangerous I would sometimes prefer to risk a small fleet as to have a larger chance of winning a large battle. The more competitive the game is the more inclined I would be to take such risks so it's especially important for multiplayer - it's not a gamechanger, though, so no pressure.

Yes, and because of this tooltips when you try to cancel a scrapping are only shown for a split second. Trust me it will mess up things.

What I consider essential for the game is this second kind of waypoints I mentioned (ships moving automatically in space after their construction to a chosen waypoint: sector or fleet) - have you thought about it? It saves so much time for players that it's a necessary feature and I am very disappointed seeing any 4X game without it.

It would be nice to have, of course I'd have to find a place for a button to set waypoint. And I'd have to be careful to not break savegames.

Edit: Hm, I've just realized that perhaps there is an easy way: no waypoints of the first kind, but there could be an option among Immediate Orders: Disregard Anomalies - a ship (a fleet) with this order would move as if there are no anomalies (taking damage if necessary). What do you say? Has it already been coded to take damage (or other harmful effects) on the fly? Or perhaps it's the reason why we can't fly through dangerous anomalies? IIRC, it wasn't coded in BotF.

This feature wouldn't be *that* useful, so I don't think it would be necessary. In most cases the detour isn't impacting the distance anyway. For example if the ship has to move 5 squares left and there is a dangerous anomaly in the way, it will move diagonally to avoid it and diagonally back, so the number of squares visited is the same as if it would travel in a straight line.

[Wo he hiv]

Wenn der Minor keine Spezialschiffe hat, dan ist es möglich. Wenn wir aber die Minors noch stärker machen dann haben wieder Heyoun und Terraner einen vorteil mMn.

Wie wäre es den Minors ohne Schiffe eine niedrigere Untergrenze zu geben ? Zum Beispiel 20 oder sogar nur 15 Milliarden ? Dann könnte man in jedem Fall das Spezialgebäude bauen und bei höherem Techlevel auch eine akzeptable Systemverteidigung (Planetare Schilde Geschütze, et cetera) aber das System wäre immer noch weit von einem guten System entfernt. Je nach Boni eines Systems ist ein System meines Erachtens frühestens ab 30 eher erst ab 40 Milliarden ein gutes System. Ausserdem wenn die KI jetzt die Invasionen auch nutzt, sind Terraner und Hanuhr da doch nicht mehr so im Vorteil. Schliesslich sind Systeme ohne Verteidigungssysteme (und das sind Minorsysteme immer, so lange sie unabhängig sind) doch ziemlich leicht zu erobern.

[blotunga]

Wenn der Minor keine Spezialschiffe hat, dan ist es möglich. Wenn wir aber die Minors noch stärker machen dann haben wieder Heyoun und Terraner einen vorteil mMn.

Wie wäre es den Minors ohne Schiffe eine niedrigere Untergrenze zu geben ? Zum Beispiel 20 oder sogar nur 15 Milliarden ? Dann könnte man in jedem Fall das Spezialgebäude bauen und bei höherem Techlevel auch eine akzeptable Systemverteidigung (Planetare Schilde Geschütze, et cetera) aber das System wäre immer noch weit von einem guten System entfernt. Je nach Boni eines Systems ist ein System meines Erachtens frühestens ab 30 eher erst ab 40 Milliarden ein gutes System. Ausserdem wenn die KI jetzt die Invasionen auch nutzt, sind Terraner und Hanuhr da doch nicht mehr so im Vorteil. Schliesslich sind Systeme ohne Verteidigungssysteme (und das sind Minorsysteme immer, so lange sie unabhängig sind) doch ziemlich leicht zu erobern.

Das kann ich mal machen... 15mrd zB. Zum thema Invasion.. was ich am KI immernoch nicht mag ist das es im späten teil des Spiels die Minorsysteme zum tode bombardiert weil es zu viele Schiffe da ansammelt. Musste ich mal auch unter die Lupe nehmen.

[Pawleus]

It would be nice to have, of course I'd have to find a place for a button to set waypoint. And I'd have to be careful to not break savegames.

Actually, you have already found a place - it's under Industry and Resource Costs on the build screen There should be a button called shortly eg. Destination in the left bottom corner and on the right of it the name of a sector (or a fleet, if you decide it's worth to add that functionality ships should also join the fleet automatically). When the button is pressed a player should be directed to the map as with trade routes to choose another sector (with fleets a player would have to go to the Military screen where should be an additional button Fleets because currently fleets are not listed anywhere, AFAIK - it's probably much more work so it should be done later if you decide it's worth the effort).

This feature wouldn't be *that* useful, so I don't think it would be necessary. In most cases the detour isn't impacting the distance anyway. For example if the ship has to move 5 squares left and there is a dangerous anomaly in the way, it will move diagonally to avoid it and diagonally back, so the number of squares visited is the same as if it would travel in a straight line.

No pressure, just to clarify: anomalies can impact distances in much larger way than you see it - even in the save I recently provided where anomalies have density only slightly larger than standard you could see it (look at those 3-in row ones) but players are allowed to create games with their densities much, much higher where their clusters are major obstacles (like the Briar Patch in the ST-verse ) and they could even cut off some regions of space.
Hm, I've just rethought it and I think now it's better the way it currently is