Modding

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UesugiKenshin
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Re: Modding

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It's my belief that no matter what, something happens every turn as galactic explorers travel in new territory and soldiers train and the crew just lives and the colonists exist. And so every turn, the player wants to see these random events and regular events to show that BotE is not just an economic game with combat elements in a space milieu, but a dynamic galaxy populated with trillions of people.

That is why serialized fiction has bottle episodes and character arcs and three episode tales. The viewer resonates with the existing characters and encounters new characters and the threat of new people and the loss of some.

A character introduced on some far away planet, may then end up as an enemy, a criminal who is smuggling, a new cadet in the empire's training facility, and that is not always on a vessel. It might have no net effect, or it may have a huge effect on diplomacy, cause an incident, make the minor race pull out of negotiations, may just be humorous, may cause pathos, or give gravitas at a personal level as a disaster may ruin their lives or be a casualty in a conflict or a climate change.

Or it's unmodded and faceless billions and trillions die.
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Re: Modding

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The program itself does not have to track all these characters. They merely are text files that get triggered on successive turns based on which empires are playing.

It's a storytelling device but sometimes may be the direct result of diplomatic negotiations.

You could even have the text state that the original diplomat was named such and such, but was caught up in a political sect as a reformer, and then was jailed and persecuted. And then replaced.

It really might no effect save to give the player something to read each turn and so care. Then maybe the diplomat escapes and is rendered assistance by a crew of a vessel, and subsequently is in witness protection through political asylum on your home sector. Then he is grateful and gives you details and all this does is add modifiers to some score.

It's a bump in the mundane turns to add conflict and conflict resolution to maintain the players' interest.
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Re: Modding

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Additional ships beyond level 14 need to be preconfigured for players as when they get into the ship designer section in the research submenu, then there is no easy way to "hit undo". You can't save these as upgrades or label them something specific. Thus then they will be shocked that while they did reconfigure ships, they lack the technology and budget to make them.

That is unfortunate but then the way around it is to load the prior autosave. Generally with new vessels you want new names and serious upgrades of double hull iridium vessels, with remarkable shields and beam weapon upgrades and multiple launcher torpedos...and so need new names...as with so many significant upgrades, it's hardly the same vessel anymore.

Besides this, you can get into situations where your actions so lower morale (but absolutely are essential upgrades like "internment camps" which are complicated regarding modifiers, naturally make Omega Alliance folks and new members...perturbed.

So consider that every minor race has a goal building that is unique to it. Constructing it should grant morale bonuses. Likely there needs to be several of these as all 4X games have such buildings...for pacification and distraction of the plebians. Bread and Circuses.

And every major empire would have museums which subtly enforce self-adoration of their culture inspiring patriotism. Concert halls and art galleries and monuments all are options.

If realistic some would be double edged swords as leftists and artistic buildings go hand in hand, and thus might reduce morale by adding subversive elements. They may add all kinds of modifiers but subtly work to cause issues on higher difficulty levels.

Likewise, it sure makes sense that higher level troups would be indicative of specialized elements like tanks, mechanized infantry, LCACs (landing craft air cushions ie fancy militarized hovercraft), etc.
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Re: Modding

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It's simplistic and one dimensional to consider that some major race empires are evil. No race ever thinks they are evil, but the winners, of battles and wars, label ...who is evil ie the Romans and Carthage.

Thus some buildings need balancing in the Omega Alliance, and likely the Catare (as I haven't played a 400+ turn with them as they are labeled the easiest). You probably keep the ones included and come up with new ones... at least 10-20 with even the Heyoun having military buildings to some degree.

No major race would stay static at 800-1200 turns, but newer generations are iconoclastic and so would begin to judge their grandparents and parents and this would be seen in higher than level 14 buildings.

Subtle shifts aggregate and join across multiple areas of the empires until the morals and ethics would change. And then on progressively higher games, then all new values would have to be inserted here.
http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... Moral.data

The Builders are not like...
the Baby Boomers who are not like...
Generation Xers who are not like...
the Millennials who are not like...
Generation Z.

So the same thing happens in the moral.data.
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Re: Modding

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The minor races have a programming trigger called "change of government" and that reflects how governments wax and wane over time causing diplomatic changes in perceived allies and enemies.

So too some advanced minor race buildings may show shifts of what those later generations hold to be precious and the ideal.

A pacifistic minor race next generation may reject that core belief in turn 1200+ and see it as anachronistic and silly.

Look at WW1 Europe and aristocratic isolationists switching to empire building appealing to populism in WW2. Everything changes at higher levels and that is suited for modding.
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Re: Modding

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I'm having an issue about turn#410+ where three systems are struggling with being members with the Omega Alliance.

There is adequate infrastructure, and yet nothing seems to ameliorate this but two minor races and even one Omega group are struggling. It's strange.

I presumed it was an issue with garrisoning adequate troops, or not having a starbase (not just a level 1 outpost but a level 2 starbase). That should have the effect of dampening down their behavior. But it's not. I haven't attacked a single system as this is a test, so only defended, despite being the largest military force.

I'm constantly spending down 200,000-300,000 credits every three turns to improve each system. Under such growth and government support, you would think they would extremely pleased. When you carefully build up infrastructure and mining, then it finally starts really paying off after turn#300+. Titanium moved up 600 for example.

It's annoying and not someone one would expect on the easiest level and having already won a research victory 20 turns prior.

I have won every engagement since turn 50+.

In a game like Medieval 2 Total War Kingdoms you had corruption as a modifier from the capital. You had lawlessness. You had unhappiness. So you built buildings to modulate the mood. This badly needs balancing.

The effects of lots of security buildings should in effect induce a police state where such rebellion is peculiar.

See:
Moral effects
http://birth-of-the-empires.de/phpBB3/v ... =39&t=1094
Morality from the BotE German Wiki
http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... itle=Moral

Are there war-torn areas where military occupation is always resisted? Sure. Thesefolks willingly were devoted and joined the Omega. Now for no discernable reason except being a little near to some Khaoran systems, they are rebelling. I suspect 1 or 2 will revolt at some point.

It may just be a planned game mechanic, but seems very random after winning.

Frankly the Khaoran were down to a single system and by some miracle ie AI cheating, they ended up inhabitating 26 systems. It makes zero sense.
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Re: Modding

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http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... itle=Moral
If you look at that carefully, the Omega Alliance is unfairly penalized regarding moral checks. They don't have a good way to boost scores within a system except for "tetroin" which is treated like the ketracel-white drug given to the Jem'hdar soldiers. But that was strictly for them, not all the citizens of the Dominion.
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Ketracel-white

It needs to be modded to be playable. I'm as rich as Crassus and able to vastly outspend the AI and doing that then depresses ore and crystal prices briefly after a sale, thus limiting the sales by the Terrans or Khaoran. Then jump right back in again and make even more.

So every planetary system I own is like a mini-Rome as every system has way way more infrastructure than they need. It's almost ridiculous as it's rapidly accelerated tech to level 11. To me the AI is really cheating as the Terrans were battling the Khaoran actively and there is no way they are making as much money to reinvest in research.
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Re: Modding

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My guess is the way it's set up, regardless of how benignly I have been playing, the Omega are supposed to be hamstrung ie supposed to be hated by default by several minor races.

Not only that, every treaty signed hurts my cause (suffer moral penalties) and still I recovered. I control only one less system than the Terrans when they have massive diplomatic powers and huge bribe resistance. It's set up for the Omega to fail. Heck I actually didn't even use espionage or sabotage until turn 410+ as I'm testing that right now. I've been playing as innocently as a lamb.
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Re: Modding

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http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... le=Energie
This is the German Wiki link on energy and how it is used in BotE. I think what happened with some of my systems (above where I had systems angry (and about to rebel) is related to it. First look at how BotE modulates energy as it's quirky micromanagement.

There is never enough energy resources for hundreds of turns, and so lots of buildings require energy, but many times you don't need them "online" ie powered up. Take the bunker network for example. You want to put it online when the enemy is likely to attack, otherwise you made what power sources you could, and would just waste the energy that turn.

Here is where the system is cumbersome. I use the manager function almost 100% of the time as I really don't want to manage the moving of workers from one area to another when I have 58 systems. But almost ...have to...manage the energy usage...some.

I made several buildings that required energy, and I presumed the manager was wisely powering them these up. NOPE! Some of them reduced morale by 1, but gave much higher taxes. Another is the internment center and this also reduces the morale by 1 but confers experience to troops. Well the whole point was to make these to get higher taxes and experience, but the manager function kept turning them off. It's very annoying. You can set exceptions but it's confusing.

So I was making enormous amounts of mining credits so, what the heck, I just made a gross excess of energy sources as this micromanaging one more element of the game is irritating. Well I disabled the manager energy function on the manager tab, but left the rest of the manager functions intact. Or so I thought. Instead it disabled the power!ARGH. I feel like cursing as this is so confusing. I played for 410 turns and was all set to start battling the Khaoran as the Terrans were backing me up, and I likely would have won.

It is not well explained and yet you have to manage this or else there is no point to making the better buildings. I made so many energy buildings that there was quite a surplus of energy, yet buildings were not online.

Think about it. Does a commander want to have to throw a switch to power up an electric fence to the perimeter, or just have it always on? The latter.

You have to think twice, maybe thrice about energy usage and modding it. See my plan was all security buildings require energy PLUS high levels of tech in all six areas and at increasingly high levels as sabotage is seriously broken. Until it's clear and straight forward and easy to document, that is the kind of thing that leaves a bad aftertaste in a player's mouth.
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Re: Modding

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Save games and caveats about using them.

The plan was to set up a general game with three empire: The Omega Alliance, the Terran Coalition, and the Khaoran Empire. The Khaorans did poorly as they openly challenged too many minor races and the Terrans and got down to a single system.

I had set the map on 40x40 with 100% stars (it actually ends up being 90%), few stellar anomalies, no aliens, no random nonsense err events. You could win by any means except intelligence as I LOATHE it as it's nonsensical.

So somehow the Khaoran come back and gain 26 systems (I suspect by AI cheating). Both the Terrans and I have about 58 systems and it's neck and neck and I squeeze out a research victory. Fine, I keep playing to 410+ and start having weird energy related rebellion.

I export my save games and do a total reload trying to figure out what the issue is. Then realize it's a function of energy micromanaging.

But then when I reload the game, the Terrans win a research game and thus...game over. The save game function is weird as it didn't remember I had won already.

Now I wanted it open ended for testing but wanted to try sabotage, battles, diplomacy, combat results, etc. Strangely enough while I was only 15% successful on diplomacy with the minor races (as the Omega's induce pure hatred quite often regardless how benevolent you play), I still managed some diplomatic negotiation.

However since I had already won with a research victory, then by no means should the Terrans win say a diplomatic victory (which they probably win 95% of the time). But they stole my research victory. That is very irritating.

Thus when creating save games, you probably want to set it to elimination as the goal so when reloading that won't happen. But if you do so, then straight away, your chance of winning as the Omegas is slight unless you resort to sabotage early.

There is no way I would have leveled up the Omegas so high with huge mining control and credit otherwise. I would have battling from turn 180 with the Terrans and then by turn 300 with the Khaoran.

That is a serious flaw in setting up scenarios by 400+ turn save games.

The other alternatives
1. A save game editor or huge amounts of hex editting.
2. Wait for a scenario editor.
3. Wait for multiplayer and play as all empires, then hope you can play it as a single player save game. I'm not optimistic and I bet few people would play a multiplayer BotEs 400+ save game. It's toohard to get people together to play.
4. Probably pointlessly wait for a hotseat mode as the German wiki or the forum had negative comments on that ever happening. Hotseat is the standard to turn off the AI, play as all empires then only leave one empire on and save the scenario. It's ideal for advanced single player mode.

There are major hurdles to overcome to mod BotE on the Android tablet. The standard player might not be able to do it unless they have a rooted tablet and a windows computer (to overcome issues with loading a non Google Play app) and then by what mechanism will others play it? Those others have the identical issues.

Modding it for Windows looks very straight foward with a combat simulator, a buildings editor, a ship editor, and a troop editor. Not a piece of cake, but pretty close. Modding has worked for years this way.
Zuletzt geändert von UesugiKenshin am Mittwoch 22. April 2020, 23:00, insgesamt 1-mal geändert.
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Re: Modding

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Without BotE being modded, you can see why it's not popular.

If you play with another empire, then ultimately it turns into a sabotage mess after turn 300+. So that is either the Rotharians, the Omega, or the Catare.

If you play with the Terrans, they will almost certainly use their godlike diplomatic power to absorb minor races into membership and at least use their fleets to great effect. No fun.

That is two strikes.

As is, in my opinion, sad to say, as awesome as BotE is, with such huge potential, it's unplayable unless you play as a subterfuge major empire like the Omega, Catare, or Rotharians. And I would pick the Rotharians as I had no issues getting peaceful membership consistently among most minor races. Then play against the Terrans and the Khaorans.

Or play as the Khaoran as a sandbox game.

BotE would be terrific after modding it, but I don't see how to do so on the Android. As it stands, any changes I make with the datafiles will then keep the program from running on the Android.
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Re: Modding

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The most fun is to rather limit colonization and so have lots of minor races and then the major empires have to deal with them. I really enjoyed that, and was very powerful by turn 410 as the Omega. When the Khaoran absorbed minor races, they foolishly wasted minor races' initial fleets against my fleets and starbases. Then were crushed.

But most players using the Omega as their choice would have great difficulty because it took hundreds of turns to make them an economic powerhouse. That's why they might win a winner-take-all scenario.

I don't think the Terrans and Khaoran could withstand that literally endless money (hundreds of thousands every 3-5 turns to rapidly accelerate and defend, then poised for giant fleets and sabotage). It would have been grand intrastellar war.

It's far easier to play as the Terrans until sabotage begins.

With very minor modding and storytelling, BotE could be the best space 4x on the Android tablet. I am totally serious. But instead, with its limits, and difficulties of documentation, it's mostly a sabotage and economic micromanagement game (something only a serious forensic CPA could enjoy).
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Re: Modding

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The only fair way to play against the Terrans is only have 10% minor races. Otherwise that diplomatic superpower is absurd.

Several friends could play a multiplayer version with "house rules on sabotage or excess use of diplomacy". Otherwise use no minor races so the Terrans just have a huge bribe resistance and better research.

With no minor races, then it's a pure conquest game. But the minor races have terrific starting vessels and great backstories, and act all unique and have excellent well thought out techtrees.
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Re: Modding

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ZArchiver is a winzip app on Google Play. If you have a tablet that allows installation of apps from places other than Google Play, that program will allow you to look within an apk and pull out a copy of a datafile. Then mod it like changing the racial attributes of a major race or comprehensively adjusting all the security buildings for minor and major races (maybe 20+ buildings). Then you drag the altered datafile back into the apk. That is the old school Android way to mod apks.

It just won't work on my personal tablet.

You could never distribute a modded source code, but merely altering the formula of galaxy generation to always have 9 planets with higher incidence of M class planets, and adjust the starting treasury to say 10,000...would vastly improve the source code. The game would be much more fun.

One the biggest irritations is drawing a grand maxed out 40x40 map with 100% stars but a rotten diversity of unusuable star systems.

Random maps sound great (infinite variety) but actually are not fun. Map design is an art in modding. The careful composition of terrain totally changes the dynamics of war. A lesser force can defeat a greater one. See Afghanistan. War is NOT number crunching with brute force but tactics, terrain variance, and better overall morale by extraordinary leadership.

History is full of determined battlehardened veterans who using the above defeated much stronger unorganized forces.
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Re: Modding

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If a brilliant military strategist begins with the Omega Alliance, they can win as they start with scraping an outpost. Everyone learns this.

What does that tell you? The starting treasury is unrealistically low. 10,000 is rapidly depleted by careful infrastructure building and a small useful fleet. It sounds like a lot, but it is not.

This is why I believe in preset scenarios so the player and the AI have a starting chance. Twice I have seen the Omega and the Khaoran suffer ignoble defeats due to likely mismanaging starting treasuries.

How many military strategy/RTS games begin from nothing? Not many.
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