Starship Class Names

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UesugiKenshin
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Starship Class Names

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There is limited length a starship class name can display as the Build # field comes next. Only the Da'unor Fighter Supreme Class is too long and so is obscured.

You can use the presets, but a major aspect is designing ships. This is a major advantage for the human player versus the AI.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Starship Class Names

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Instead, it would smarter to have shorter starship classes followed by revision #s.

Example
Da'unor Fighter Supreme Class becomes

Da'unor FS 1 as the basic model

Da'unor FS 2 has a better hull and slightly better shields and weaponry.

Da'unor FS 3 has an even better hull, better shields, and stronger weaponry and maybe better torpedoes.

Da'unor FS 4 is the very best of everything that will fit that Fighter class.

If successive class have revisions, and lower revisions are then antiquated, then the AI based on technology is making better starships just like the human players. And it is simpler for those who don't want to mess with the ship designer.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Starship Class Names

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When you acquire better minor race technology through membership, you can alter the torpedo launchers and torpedo types. This confers serious advantages. When your entire fleet is doing that kind of customization plus is diverse, uses a command ship, etc, than that fleet has devastating power especially when experienced.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Starship Class Names

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In the Balancer mod, my plan is to have this system plus have some very advanced starships at very high tech levels well beyond level 14. My thinking is through espionage and major investment in research, and after learning all level 14 research, that major races would steal ideas from the minor races at first and incorporate those technologies like cloaking into their starship classes. So they look the same but have incredible speed, range, and manueverability along with devasting weaponry.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Starship Class Names

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While a major race might acknowledge some minor race created a fine warship, they might be so different, or their ethos so diametrically opposed, or that species has significant negative attributes so including them as members would eventually be problematic. Some can really help with sabotage, while others ruin intelligence espionage and sabotage.

Thus advanced research might give them that particular particle weaponry or torpedo type, but not have the burden of watching over them or absorbing them into the empire.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Starship Class Names

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A tactician would sort their starships by class and so then know, "Oh those are rev 3 and not strong enough to deal with those Khaoran warships. I have to send a different fleet."
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Starship Class Names

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On a huge map and a fully populated galaxy, then some starships and fleets are antiquated, even from the beginning have those have titanium hulls. Many of the ships the AI may be sending are rather weak and inappropriate and not much of a challenge.

And in a complex mod, then you end up with a change in history based on turn #5 to turn #250 versus turn#750 and so a modder could create generations of starships with such small empires.
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Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
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Re: Starship Class Names

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Say a much more robust minor race fleet would include much stronger starship vessels and they would squash you like a bug if you tried to attack them in a mod set up for advanced players. Those rev numbers reflect far more powerful minor races that cannot be easily exploited.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Starship Class Names

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So what I might do is make some minor races space faring, but have puny craft. Others are not to be trifled with until maybe turn #750. Not unless you want explorers to find your fleet's scorched debris scattered across that sector. Maybe some are mediors and have a minor foothold nearby in a sector.

So there would be lots and lots of starship revisions with some incredible ones at level #20 research...at a huge price.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Starship Class Names

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12 mangy dogs can take down a lion.
Marc Antony
Rome tv series

However BotE is configured, you have to take into account this pack mentality tactic. One starship is most likely not very manueverable as the size increases and its combat role. Sure, it can take out many less powerful ones, but in a coordinated fashion, and due to being alone, even three or four far weaker ships can take out a ship that is as strong as those 3-4 ships and taking into account costs like turns to create, raw materials, and technology.

Some empire might chose to:
1. Use very many inexpensive ships.
2. Use a combination of that and a main ship in a flight like dogfighters.
3. Use very robust ships and so they suffer far less attrition.

A planned campaign organized by a human would try to band together even a hodge-podge of say captured ships through sabotage, and then send 20 of them against a dreadnought which typically are extremely poor at manueverability.

It would take a LOT of orchestrated combat testing to determine factual evidence based results versus conjecture. Then it gets complex based on fleet composition coupled with experience.

I urge folks to read the complex BotE wiki and posts I have made on this subject as it makes a rather large difference in an actual battle.

I plan on giving the AI a lot of help by enabling it to make what it wants as well as electing to make more expensive options by generations of starships within a class.

The AI is seriously crippled as it has few options and does not seem to use the ship designer. If the AI has a large diverse total number of starships say 500 to 2000 in various classes with great variety of generations and has prebuilt fleets with a LARGE treasury, and much more tech that it normally has, then even on the easiest level, the AI should be significantly more robust.

The AI may only be hampered as it doesn't have experienced level 6 troops on experienced transports with a powerful escort. But what if it has many of them? I think the AI will kick some cosmic ass.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Starship Class Names

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Human beings who are untrained militia will be hesitant and so a smart veteran soldier, particularly one who is spec ops and trained to fight by stealth like a guerilla, can chew up a dozen.
But 12 trained soldiers against even the best veteran spec ops can defeat him even with inferior equipment if they apply tactics. And the way this happens in fleets is by unit composition commanded by a flagship and based on starship attributes.

This will be crucial if modded so higher level starships become not just more manueverable but cloaked and nimble. They will be able to dart like dogfighters and ambush their foes.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
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Re: Starship Class Names

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As it stands now, the way the AI creates fleets is weird and seemingly ineffective. If BotE is like other wargames, the AI does not send ships to gain experience or be repaired. These are serious errors. More of the same ships offer less than optimal advantages.

For the BotE AI it's about numbers and unemotional. A human commander is not like that but tries to reduce losses and is more cautious perhaps overly cautious versus accomplishing some goals.

I am bad about that. I have lots of captured scouts that are low end, and frankly disposable as they cost me nothing, yet I don't want to waste them, when I could have explored the entire map a hundred turns prior, but would have lost some.
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Re: Starship Class Names

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In my present game, I probably have 300+ captured starships, but instead of using them, I routed them to be trained. That is not necessarily a good idea as the older a ship is, the more irrelevant it is as better classes are available. It might be wiser to scrap them in some circumstances.

Yeah, they then are trained, but maybe to get to the sector to be trained is 14 turns in a single direction, so 14 more to get back. Figure 30 turns sitting in the sector gaining experience. That is 58 turns just costing upkeep and it's getting more and more irrelevant. That is an expensive dinosaur, right?
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
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Re: Starship Class Names

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That is pragmatism and it's an ugly reality as every soldier's usefulness is usually in the first 20 years from age 18 - 38 with a decline in usefulness versus experience as they physically no longer have the same constitution and agility and strength. There is no retrofitting in BotE and no command structure so experienced crews gain authority. I wish there were. That plays a role in the Total War games with named characters.
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Re: Starship Class Names

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See the advanced Omega save game topic on why a defenseless inhabited sector when invaded likely needs an assault ship escort without using torpedoes. For the Omega, a modified Saijin class starship probably with heavy armor and beam weapons only.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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